33 replies to this topic

[White_Potato]

It is horrible to play Sarranids vs most of the other factions, so can we at least try to change/improve something?

 

It is literally a waste of 20min of half of the players time when u have to attack on Vaegirs archers etc. It is fucking suffer. U die on 1 hit and u have to do like 2-4 hits to kill someone. Unfair, stupid and waste of time.

 

 

My proposal:

temporary improvements like low prices for better armors, maybe new stuff, maybe lower price for gun, maybe some better shields to see if it can help.

[Sega]

Swadia forever!

[Marcel]

The shields idea is beach ball sized nuts good. I would fucking appreciate if some other factions could have some sort of "stab" sword option too.  

[HeiHo]

I in fact like playing as Sarranid. I have good memories of that 2h sword they have. So that with javelins is quite much ok combo for me. Their archers are not bad either and their cavalry is worst after Swadia imo.

[BlackDeath]

I have to say (my opinion as archer) that sarranids archers are better than vaegirs, they have better sword and fire arrows, so to me is not a problem helping my team to win as sarranid-archer and I like it. Also the 2h sword for sarranids, as HeiHo said, is good.

[Mikhail]

I agree with the proposal of the shields and to low the price of the best armours, yep. But I'm still thinking that sarranids are very powerful, you can kill a lot of enemies before dying.

Double handed sword/axe/maze and full throwing knifes = death
1h axe and shield with throwing weapons = death
Horse archer on sarranids is OP and cheap. And with fire arrows if you have neogk. If sarranid attackers play good against the vaegir archers they can win easily.
We can't forget the 2h stick of wood or kendo stick of Goku. Is so powerful too, but it takes more hits to kill the enemy.

I think it doesn't need any other change, just change the thought that they are bad because I remember won lots of times being attacker with sarranids, even with you attacking years ago

[BlackDeath]

Remember... factions (whatever) are good if your team/players is/are good

and it's not usual ofc...   (+ ...players afk, other teamhitting each-other at back respawn as idiots instead help playing, and long etc. which doesn't help )

 

Hint: help against archers (for any faction)... use shields+push!!! ...avoid enemy infantry and go for them (ranged) even if can't kill any, you will disturb them and in this way you will help your infantry behind you

[Aratar]

The thing is, Vaegir archers are surely better than Sarranid archers.

Here is why:

 Screenshot_77.png   239.88KB   2 downloads  Screenshot_78.png   252.85KB   1 downloads

Links for Vaegirs and Sarranids

https://prnt.sc/msld0g
https://prnt.sc/msld4r

You can see here that Vaegirs are 2 points better in Power Draw (which is a huge deal), but have 2 points less Ironflesh and 1 point less Strength to lower their advantage a bit. So in terms of shooting, Vaegirs are the best with bows, although they might have less health, but I'm not sure.

 

And here is the rest of the factions with bows:

 Screenshot_79.png   235.99KB   0 downloads   Screenshot_80.png   250.23KB   1 downloads

Links for Khergits and Nords

https://prnt.sc/msld7p
https://prnt.sc/msld9j

Might need to open new discussions.

 

WNL handled these inequalities this way. I think these changes are server sided, because back in the day when I hosted servers with modified weapons and armors (maybe stats, I don't remember it's been so long) anyone with Native module could join without troubles. Though I might be wrong, please correct me if I am.

 

This isn't a full analysis and I might have missed somethings, I tried to present facts, without much personal opinion. Please go further than me and join the discussion. Let me know if there's any other stats you want, or if you want me to make a more informative and detailed analysis with more stats in another topic.

 

I personally don't think we need to make any major changes. I played this game like how it was for years now, I didn't even had the idea to check these stats until now.

 

PS: Links are provided in the case I would have to delete the attachments in a future date.

Edited by Aratar, 03 March 2019 - 02:10 PM.

[BamBam]

Just don't remove the two-handed kebab sword, I love it.

[BlackDeath]

@Aratar I know that Vaegirs have better settings/accuracy for archers (many time as archer so I've tested 100% all factions, and playing them I have better sensations shoting), but that I mean is that sarranids are better (to me) because fire arrows using neogk

[DracoTheDragon]

The thing is, Vaegir archers are surely better than Sarranid archers.

Here is why:

Screenshot_77.png Screenshot_78.png

Links for Vaegirs and Sarranids

https://prnt.sc/msld0g
https://prnt.sc/msld4r

You can see here that Vaegirs are 2 points better in Power Draw (which is a huge deal), but have 2 points less Ironflesh and 1 point less Strength to lower their advantage a bit. So in terms of shooting, Vaegirs are the best with bows, although they might have less health, but I'm not sure.

 

And here is the rest of the factions with bows:

Screenshot_79.png Screenshot_80.png

Links for Khergits and Nords

https://prnt.sc/msld7p
https://prnt.sc/msld9j

Might need to open new discussions.

 

WNL handled these inequalities this way. I think these changes are server sided, because back in the day when I hosted servers with modified weapons and armors (maybe stats, I don't remember it's been so long) anyone with Native module could join without troubles. Though I might be wrong, please correct me if I am.

 

This isn't a full analysis and I might have missed somethings, I tried to present facts, without much personal opinion. Please go further than me and join the discussion. Let me know if there's any other stats you want, or if you want me to make a more informative and detailed analysis with more stats in another topic.

 

I personally don't think we need to make any major changes. I played this game like how it was for years now, I didn't even had the idea to check these stats until now.

 

PS: Links are provided in the case I would have to delete the attachments in a future date.

I would say the use of flaming arrows at least brings it close enough to say they are even!! Go PYRO!!!!

[The_Knight_Who_Says_NI]

The thing is, Vaegir archers are surely better than Sarranid archers.

Here is why:

Screenshot_77.png Screenshot_78.png

Links for Vaegirs and Sarranids

https://prnt.sc/msld0g
https://prnt.sc/msld4r

You can see here that Vaegirs are 2 points better in Power Draw (which is a huge deal), but have 2 points less Ironflesh and 1 point less Strength to lower their advantage a bit. So in terms of shooting, Vaegirs are the best with bows, although they might have less health, but I'm not sure.

 

And here is the rest of the factions with bows:

Screenshot_79.png Screenshot_80.png

Links for Khergits and Nords

https://prnt.sc/msld7p
https://prnt.sc/msld9j

 

 

Looking at those stats, Khergs archers really are the loosers in the end: 142 archery(?), no iron flesh.

 

Anyway, Warband is an unbalanced game , that's the way it is. Personally i'm fine with Sarranids; yeah it can be a challenge in Siege, just like Khergs. That's why i always play those factions.

Nothing more satisfying than laughing at  Nord team when they loose against pyjamas ...

i generally try to play them roleplay style: light armour (the second choice) , jarids, light shield, and those handy short axes. If shield break and jarids empty i try to pick up opponent stuff on battlefield.

[deformedgremlin]

Sarranids worsest 

[White_Potato]

Looking at those stats, Khergs archers really are the loosers in the end: 142 archery(?), no iron flesh.

 

Anyway, Warband is an unbalanced game , that's the way it is. Personally i'm fine with Sarranids; yeah it can be a challenge in Siege, just like Khergs. That's why i always play those factions.

 

I do it like you. But how long one can stand this?  Sometimes you have 3-4 maps in a row and you loos all of them because of chosing sarranigs/khergits.

[Annabella Campbell]

By the way, the Saranid cavalry is probably the most boring in the whole game. It is not as bad as the Nords or Rods (but they have something special, for example, a morgenstern or an  cav axe) but not so good as Vaegirs or my lovely Swadia

Maybe they should add some kind of unique weapon or armor, i dont know.

Maybe I am mistaken, but for all the time I played, I had this impression

[BlackDeath]

Only for info, an example...

sometimes shit good happens ...when you have luck to play with good team (players) around: yesterday I was playing as attacker and Sarranids won 2-1 against Nords...

 

and Nords were defending

[Pêche]

I do it like you. But how long one can stand this?  Sometimes you have 3-4 maps in a row and you loos all of them because of chosing sarranigs/khergits.

Khergits are  weak, everyone knows that and this is one of the reason why there is no khergit faction in competitive tournament.

 

Secondly, as BD said, it depend if the team are balanced. If you put all players who have like 3000+ hours on M&B (as Sarra - in the attacking team) against a lot of New_Player (as Nords or Vaegir or Swadia etc.. - in the defending team) you will rarely/never win a round/map.

 

I have no problems to kill Swadians / Vaegirs / Nords / Rhodoks as Sarranids.

[The_Knight_Who_Says_NI]

I do it like you. But how long one can stand this?  Sometimes you have 3-4 maps in a row and you loos all of them because of chosing sarranigs/khergits.

Ye sometimes  it can be frustrating to be in a loosing streak while your k/d ratio drops down in a very ugly way.

But really,

 

1 : One single victory on those nasty  chainmailed greatswords wielding-warbowfreaks  is worth it.

It means your team put some serious effort and reward is as big It's in  those moment that i enjoy teamplay the most.

 

3: bad cycle doesn't happen all the time.

 

2: it's just a game in the end.

Edited by The_Knight_Who_Says_NI, 05 March 2019 - 05:14 PM.

[Pepper]

From my experience Sarranids aren't actually bad they're just generally bad on maps where they need to rely on their own defence, but that's more of the fault of player gearing choices more than anything else. If they can aggressively push easily they're pretty damn strong due to fast bows and heavy hits.

 

Sarranid Axes are insanely good tbh and if people geared more towards head armour they'd have an easier time. The 430 denar helmet can withstand a headshot, for instance, while the cheaper helmets are just terrible. I never gear a sarranid without it.

 

But yeah Sarranids have plenty of weaknesses, their archers are a bad matchup against most other archers as their bows lack punch to headshot good helmets. Fire arrows usually aren't worth it anyway due to the -10 ammo cap, meaning if you take two sets you're missing 20 arrows which imo is never worth it. The 2h sabre is really good too if you're good enough at avoiding archers.

 

I think they get a lot of hate which is usually just players not fully understanding their strengths. Their armour etc looks weak but if you spend your denars well you can make strong starter builds.

 

The main focus should be on Khergit if anything.

[BlackDeath]

 

Fire arrows usually aren't worth it anyway due to the -10 ammo cap, meaning if you take two sets you're missing 20 arrows which imo is never worth it.

As archer, half of my gameplay time I'm looking for more arrows (left by the dead on the ground/floor) to never be "out of ammo" I like do this because it is an add for reality